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013 - The Dynamics of Today's Real Estate Market

• Justin Bogard & Super E • Season 3 • Episode 13

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2 Wealth Show S3 Ep13 – The Dynamics of Today's Real Estate Market

 Alex Goldovsky  -  CEO of ProTitle USA Gets interviewed by Justin Bogard and Super E in Season 3, Episode 13. 

 Get to know how ProTitle USA was built and  updates about today's busy real estate market.

 Key Takeaways:  

  1. How ProTitle USA was born 
  2. Growing Your Business 
  3. Current Hurdles In The Real Estate Industry 

 Resources and links discussed  

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About the Hosts

Justin Bogard – Note Investor specializing in performing Residential Real Estate Debt. He finds deals and acquires them for his own portfolio as well as educates investors while walking them through the process of owning a Real Estate Note! 

Super E – Real Estate Investor specializing in short-term rentals and the management of them. She connects investors with short-term tenants and manages everything in-between.  

  Connect with the Hosts: 

  • @2wealthshow – Facebook/Instagram 
  • @wealth_show - Twitter 

 

Speaker 1:

[inaudible] welcome to the, to wealth show a show that shares how you can create real wealth for you and your family. I'm one of your hosts, Justin Bogart. And my co-host is Elizabeth Sickles, AKA super easy. I am a real estate note investor specializing in performing residential real estate debt. I find the deals acquire them for my own portfolio, as well as educate investors while walking them through the process of owning a real estate note. My co-host super eat a real estate investor specializing in short-term rentals and the management of them. She connects investors with short-term tenants and manages everything in between. Our show was sponsored by Bryghtpath notes. And Elizabeth May aura. You can find out more information by visiting our websites@brightpathnotesdotcomandelizabethmedora.com.

Speaker 2:

Welcome back to episode number 13. Hey superego. How's it going?

Speaker 3:

It is a beautiful day in Indianapolis, but got to love that

Speaker 2:

It is, it's not scorching hot. Like it was a few weeks ago. I actually just got back from Charleston. So you may, I may look a little darker today.

Speaker 3:

Well, we liked the lighter weather cause it's a lot nicer on our HVAC units. So

Speaker 2:

That is true. Yeah. I came back and I noticed that I had set or thermostat to like 77 and I was like, oh, I should have turned that down with my app before I got home. It's a little warm now. Gotta love technology. All right. So episode 13, I just want to get right into this cause I'm excited about our guest today. Um, he is the founder and CEO of ProTitle USA and Elizabeth. A lot of us in the real estate note industry, we kind of lean on having title searches done when we buy notes and stuff. Cause we want to see what is on title with, uh, with the lean that we're buying. And so it's very important. So he's, uh, one of the most sought after people in our business has got a really great program and search system all built into pro title and told me, so I decided to have him on his company is actually in the Inc 5,000 list and it's made it in there six years in a row. That's awesome. And one year he was even in the top 700, I think I want to, I want to say 700. I might be not speaking correctly, but anyways, Alice[inaudible] from ProTitle. I'm going to bring them on. Hey Alex,

Speaker 4:

Justin, welcome to the show.

Speaker 2:

How is it out there? And are you in Pennsylvania? Yeah,

Speaker 4:

It's a great, let's just move on. Next question.

Speaker 2:

So Alex, when did you start a pro title?

Speaker 4:

So I started ProTitle and um, the idea was born in, in 2007, officially of the company was launched in, uh, 2008 and uh, I started ProTitle for a wrong market. Uh, I always thought that well, uh, with the financial crash and a crisis of housing and aids services, like title search would be needed for people that buy distressed assets. So what I did is I created a company, learned everything there is to know. And, uh, my idea was to, uh, stand next to the footsteps of the foreclosure house and give away the free diver reports for folks staffs, um, really needed them at the time of the auction. I was very wrong. Nobody needed those reports. Everybody already have those. And that disappoint that disappointment. I said, well, something has to be different. And uh, I have an idea of doing nationwide online research to make it simple for investors to buy ahead of time for the auction. So this is how the idea was born and, and that's, uh, sort of, uh, why it took off. Um, I figured out where, and what time the investors before they buy the property at the auction would need. And, uh, that's, uh, that's sort of the start of the, uh, profile real site.

Speaker 2:

So you said you just learned everything you need to know about title, title searches. So that had to been a pretty daunting task because you don't know hardly anything when it comes to title. Cause I'm always learning something new. So that just amazes me right there. Yeah.

Speaker 4:

You know, it's um, it's one of those things where, uh, when you are the investor to real estate and I was the investor prior to starting ProTitle I bought a university housing properties. I bought apartment complexes and I used one firm that I really hate it. They always miss stuff and this was inaccurate. It took forever. And it got me to the point of, I was so angry. I said, I will do it better. And you know, just that piece alone made me study everything. There is no about title in one jurisdiction, the next jurisdiction then similarity in state laws in, in federal laws and slowly but surely it was starting to build out the platform to approach on a nationwide level, uh, the title research for any properties, residential, commercial, vacant land, whatever you have, we can search and we know how to do it. So, uh, at that point that the two, probably six months in 2008 to really understand the nationwide markets. So took sleepless nights, a lot of coffee, but we got this.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's incredible. I know when I first got into the real estate note space, people were talking about pro title and using a title search. I'm like, well, that's pretty cool. You can just go online and give them the property address. And then boom, they spit out a report and sure enough, that's exactly what it was. And obviously it's more detailed than that. And they have, you know, auxiliary type of, or ancillary, sorry, ancillary services that they do, you know, besides just general title searches. Uh, but it's, it's very cool process. Uh, Alex, I want to say you just go online and you type in the address and you know, you'll get a report back to you within, um, it's typically within a few days. I mean, I don't know, you don't guarantee that, but you know, I find it pretty quick process and it's pretty thorough too.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, exactly. And, and, uh, uh, it's interesting that the idea to subtitle social line was not the original idea, but when I started the company, um, you can imagine mean in the swimming trunk, sitting at the pool of my friend's house and drinking beer. And, um, you know, at the time of the, uh, uh, idea was born, we build a website and the, uh, you know, in the next five seconds, we'll post the website online and, and enable Google ads. So the advertisement is running in line. And, um, you know, that was just an experiment, right? Um, once we click the button to enable the Google ads and start rotating nationwide ads online for the business, you know, a second later I received a phone call and my friend goes, who is calling you? I said, I have no idea. It's a number that, that property is from the Google ads. So I pick up the phone and the guy on the other line says, Hey, I'm a big developer in Florida. And I have title searches to do, can you do a hundred in, in two days, I'm looking at my phone. I think we found something, you know, take the credit cards. I, you know, everything was done for free. So, but the fact that a second later we receive a phone call with a large order, you know, and that was just one guy experimenting on, on the business. So that, that made me think that online is really a good niche go after because a lot of people have different needs. It was a bit has a need in buying the real estate, uh, properties and rentals rights, Justin bison notes. So a lot of people have different different needs. And it just, you found that niche where, uh, the need can be served pretty much nationwide by one company. And that's what we attacked as the, as the market space for our company. Right. So, so online and really, I, I guess, being in the right place at the right time, um, made me realize that I think there's something there. And, uh, I think online is, was the first step towards developing the company.

Speaker 3:

Can you talk about Alex, the fact that, you know, some title companies they're just in one state, but why you made the leap to be nationwide? So not only about that, but also not necessarily the process, but maybe some of the biggest hurdles and why you kept on pushing through those because that's a huge advantage that you have.

Speaker 4:

Yeah. So that, that's exactly the weakness of the market. At the time when I started, uh, you have large investors, large banks like LA large wall street funds that are investing in nationwide pools of properties or notes. And, uh, they always had a pain point of hiring different companies then dealing with the, uh, paper reports, looking from here, files or faxes, uh, trying to consolidate the information into a single source. And there were only a few nationwide companies that were acquired slow, uh, companies like Stuart first, American fidelity, usual suspects in the market that really specialized in settlement and closing services. They want to go after premium and title search was a, you know, buy-side or, you know, not very important, uh, revenue element for them. So I found out that the title search alone is really important for, uh, folks at the buying in volume nationwide and producing, or, or trying to produce a report that will give them the view of the whole portfolio. Not necessarily one property here, one property there, or, uh, I'll just generate a hundred reports for you to look through and then rely on you to understand every little element of, uh, the type of report and make sure I basis. I said, well, I want to solve the problem. And I want to not only deliver title, search report, but also, you know, solve the pain point on the market where it doesn't matter where the property is in what state or county, what jurisdiction I will apply. The local jurisdiction laws, federal laws, state laws, to give the information about what's wrong with that property, with that title in the nice Excel spreadsheets or over API to a large investor. That was my goal. Uh, having a computer science, marketing and architectural backgrounds, um, I have made a goal in the year or two to build a platform for large buyers, right? So guys like, uh, Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae, uh, who are using us right now, or, uh, very, very large fonts that buy in billions of dollars, um, would be using us for, um, for processing large orders and having a single report and relying on them completely to give them a picture of what's going on with portfolio basis. So that, that was the pain point that was solved. Now they issues obviously, you know, uh, the starting points it's every small business comes, goes through the same stages. First it's a one-man show it's me. So I have to do everything right. It's pure hospital. Then you hire a, an employee number one, and you say, oh, I just got free time. So let me market the business. And the more you hire another person, another person. And, and now it becomes a game of bringing more business, um, while you're hiring more people to support it. So, um, as of right now, we are, uh, really, you know, 52 full-time employees. We have a center in El Salvador. We have about, uh, 1200 people on the ground that are 10 90 nines for us. We have, uh, we're using the it development center. We have about a three to five, a hundred people in India that do mechanical things for us. So we're now big, big operation to service, a large, uh, large banks or large hedge funds, but it all started with one man. That's incredible growth.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. That's awesome. So you, you had mentioned that you have a background in kind of computer science and stuff. And I, I noticed, uh, you know, on your LinkedIn profile, I had to kind of troll you a little bit to get some more info about you. So you have, like, you have a master's degree in engineering, and then you just, I guess you learned how to, how to do, um, well, I'll let you talk about it. Cause I don't, I don't know. Probably not explain it correctly.

Speaker 4:

Yeah. I have a master's in engineering. I have what nine has a U S patents. And I worked for companies like at and T bell labs and, um, uh, you know, Intel and other similar firms that are, you know, fortune 500 back in the days, uh, you know, big and telecom and, um, you know, it all starts, well, let me just say that, that those starts with your wife for my right. So, uh, I had a full-time job. Everything was great. I was the architect and I was the head of marketing for one of the firms. And, um, um, most of my friends were in there for 10 years. So we are sitting there at the table and, uh, uh, one of the guys, he owns probably seven businesses and is breaking a little bit. And to me, I thought that, you know, I am receiving very decent salary and, and I'm happy. And, and, uh, then he says, well, I'm making death much right off the bat. When he said the number, I had a short circuit in my brain and I said, something's wrong here? You know, I have my master's, I have bad insight. I'm well-respected and telecom industry, and the guy doesn't have any education. And, and he is, he's bragging about some numbers that are not reasonable to me. I come home to my wife. I said, listen, you know, you know, something's wrong with this picture? Just ask, all right, let's do this. It takes two for the business. I will cover for the household. And I have my first child, you do whatever it takes to do the business. And, um, while, uh, working during the day, I was developing the business and the websites and learning all kinds of things at nights. Uh, I, I I'd say I didn't sleep well for three to four months, but it's all started with my wife pushing me. Right. So otherwise I'm pretty lazy. I don't want to do anything, leave me so, uh, to Mexico and I'll be happy, but, uh, you know, I'm happy to share that, you know, it, it always starts with probably that story. You need a, a wife to, uh, push the men in that direction. Well, should that push me? So, um, and then I realized, you know, that there's something there already, totally the story about, you know, uh, me sitting there and launching the sites, but I think one phone call changed at all. Um, it was 2008. And, uh, obviously I was, um, still trying to develop was very, very shaky operation, but, uh, uh, and that was still the one answering the phones when somebody calls. So I received a phone call and, uh, you know, they said, there's this profile, so yeah. Uh, well, not like this, but yeah. Yeah. Well, we'll do title searches. Uh, this is FDAC. Ooh. Okay. Uh, well we have a little issue. We need all hands on deck to do massive amount of the fatal searches because we have a lot of bank failures and we need to underride the bank assets to go and run them on, uh, structured sales. So, um, I'm listening to this and, and, uh, the next question is, you know, can you handle a 2000 commercial property, uh, title searches? Or do you think I said, yeah, I was, I was show at the time and now you're starting to figure out how do I make it happen? Right. So it's one of those things where the Swan coal changed. My thinking on, you know, there are other institutions, other farms out there that need a high, high volume of property boats. And, uh, so that was 2008. Um, we delivered everything on time within the cost structure that they asked for. Um, and as of right now, there's only one company servicing MVAC as a subcontractor that's us. So before as 12 to start with, uh, and that was the only one. So we did everything possible to make sure that, you know, we always exceed client expectations, especially when we get business, um, without having connections in the industry without knowing the right people, without having a pool for all from relatives or without taking clients to the goals, uh, outings, you know, we, as soon as right, as soon as we, uh, we get the client, we'll make sure that if it's performance wise from customer support. So, uh, main thing, the client, we typically don't lose any clients, um, outside of, you know, clients filing bankruptcies, which we have clients, uh, you know, not being, or, or other, uh, stories like this, um, which typically main thing the clients and keeping them happy.

Speaker 2:

W what I like about this is that, you know, you talk about how these really large companies that you're able to facilitate their request and run their title searches, but for the person that's like, what's called a one-off investor like myself. Uh, you, you easily cater to that as well with online systems. So it's, it's works beautifully hand in hand with you. How, no matter how large you are or how small you are, it's, you know, everybody, everybody wins

Speaker 4:

Absolutely for us. Uh, it doesn't matter if, if you're a huge, huge fund or a person that told there's more a report a month or a year, it still goes through the same process. In fact, uh, folks that are ordering, um, a small number of searches, they get the priority because we set up the time schedule for delivery of the large projects, uh, and, uh, uh, folks that they're ordering a one or two a month, they get priority. We want to make sure that they had the, uh, we have, um, typically estimated timeframe of about 48 to 72 hours to deliver the report. But, um, yeah, so, so we, we try to standardize, uh, at least 90% of United States to get to that timeframe. Now, some people think that we'll work over the weekends, not anymore. So if you order on Friday, it'll be done Monday, Tuesday, and we need some breasts. Uh, it's folks really give us a hard time. Hey, are you there to report on Friday? Where's the report on Sunday? You know, it's, um, we, we tried to explain to folks, but, um, I still, there's a few that will do some things sooner. We can be angry on Monday, right? A typical is 48 to 72.

Speaker 2:

I don't think you can satisfy those people there. They're just, they have, but in their mind that everyone's working 20, 24 7. So

Speaker 4:

Yeah. And some people do, we don't, it's just, you know, uh, when, when you start growing as a firm, you, you can be a small business anymore and you have to make sure people arrest them. Even though we have folks with me on the rotation of monitoring things over the weekend, but it's right now, we have a 24 hour operation,

Speaker 3:

Which is great. And can you talk about some of the hurdles that you see in the industry right now and what you guys are doing as a title company to overcome those?

Speaker 4:

Yeah, there's, there's sexual right now is, is, is a number of hurdles. And let me, let me take a step back and give you a flavor of what we see. Um, I get to see you in a place where we see a lot of, uh, trade volume coming across us and coming across our desks. I can tell you that in the past two weeks, we've already looked at probably four to$6 billion worth of assets in the past two weeks. So, yeah. So get value that's, uh, on the market, a lot of, um, large banks like Bayview, Goldman Sachs, uh, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, um, JP Morgan and chase, uh, selling, uh, both re-performing assets and, um, forming assets to the market. Um, folks that are waiting for a flood of, uh, trades to come through, it's calming. It's, it's really a tsunami wave that will, uh, cover the whole market. The, um, the reason is, uh, I think some of the larger servicers are not able to process that many, uh, default services servicing, um, for, uh, folks or homeowners that are coming off the forbearance into, uh, delinquency. And they're trying to position themselves for something that they can handle easily, um, and really, um, liquidate to the capital markets. Some of the things that are exits, um, we've seen the trades being very, very large, in fact, um, you know, thousand to 2000 loans per, uh, each anthropologist named. So the secondary market is, is a significance, uh, lone panels. And, um, they seem to continue, right? We, we, we, we see that the next schedule sale will be for example, 12,000 loans, um, in the first week of next month. And that's all we're performing, right? So, so you can see that there's a big flood gates of loans and properties that probably get to justice desk, I'd say, in the next six months. Uh, the reason for that is not just the, uh, uh, capacity of the market for the vendors, right? So every, every bender right now creating 120, 150%, uh, capacity, right? So there's no free capacity left in the market. Um, not just because of the number of rules, but because of COVID, uh, in India, right? So a lot of the big banks, they offshore a lot of their stuff. And, uh, with, with, uh, COVID and restrictions in India, a lot of companies are suffering. So that really creates a, um, not, not a great, um, bender, uh, marketplace, uh, for processing larger orders. Um, the same time of the year are you can, you can probably see that, um, a lot of firms are foreclosure firms, uh, attorneys, uh, hiring paralegals to start processing the, uh, uh, foreclosure cases again. So apparently, um, banks can start foreclosure, uh, in the 1st of January, and you will probably find a flaw, the foreclosures being filed and running through the courts. So you have the bottleneck in the courts, but at the same time, uh, lenders are trying all kinds of ways to go outside of the court system, to, um, do a model with a borrower or to a reset loan on the capital market, uh, to make sure that they are not impacted or velocity of investment is not impacted by delays in courts. So there's a lot of momentum going on. And I think to answer your question, Elizabeth, the biggest problem on the market right now is capacity or vendors everybody's, uh, super extended work, uh, weekends overtime to meet the timelines. And it's still not enough. Uh, some of the firms that, for example, um, do compliance reviews for the loans, um, might be a month to month and a half behind a lot of small vendors or small clients. Small banks were caught off by some of the larger compliance spenders because of the capacity issues. Um, some of the titled lenders like, like myself also are struggling to meet the timelines of, of trades or, uh, timelines of, of deliberately delivery to the, to the clients on, um, refinancing, closing. So a lot of that is going on and I think that's the current problem, Marcus. Um, there's other problems there as well. Right. Um, uh, I think, um, um, with the, uh, uh, in the trade you can ask, so you will probably be a, um, some momentum in, again, um, more sales coming to the market with respect to, uh, some of the delinquent notes because of the interest rates going up and, and, uh, more workers are not willing to pay, um, the higher interest rate. Uh, they were not able to refinance and therefore, um, because of the, a bad credit score or, um, just being behind for, for so many payments. So, uh, certainly you'll see the flat of those coming to the market as well. So that's pretty much the overview of, uh, some of the issues of the market today and, uh, and, uh, you know, what we're doing to solve them. Certainly we, we are hiring like crazy. That's another, that's another issue right now. Right. Um, nobody's willing to come back. We see every day we hired only one person in the past six months, we were running ads six months in a row. And, and it just folks are not willing to come back to work yet. Um, so that's, that's big,

Speaker 2:

Uh, Alex, that was some great insight as to what's going on kind of behind the curtain. Thank you so much for sharing that information. And a lot of your points. I didn't even take into consideration before when I was, when I was thinking about what's going to happen, you know, with the forbearances and stuff. So thanks for alluding to that from, from what you see in your side of things.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's, it's really a very dynamic mark. You have to keep your eyes on the ball. Um, I think, uh, I'm hoping, or I'm hoping for my clients, attorneys in foreclosure firms, um, federal government will no longer extend the timelines as they did for about six months because those firms are really suffering. They laid everybody off, just can't be partnering with felonies and they, they, they have, they don't have paralegals or enough staff to go ahead and process what's coming. So that's that's separately.

Speaker 2:

Wow. That's very interesting. So just for our listeners and our, our, uh, viewing audience on our YouTube channels, Bryghtpath notes, Elizabeth Mejora, um, Alex's website is pro title usa.com. That's pro title usa.com. So you can visit there. You, uh, there's no real login. I believe Alex, right? You just kind of go in there, you can search exactly what you want, if you want, you know, if you're looking for a note for notes or properties, you know, you can enter in stuff easily for residential commercial, and they'll generate a report within a few days, like you said, 48 to 72 hours. The is very, very easy.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, exactly. It's a, you can, you can, there, there are some ancillary services that you can know there as well. Uh, if you have a volume of orders, spend a spreadsheet replacement for you, if you don't have a place, one thing at a time, uh, and then if you have more than 20 properties of 40 notes, we can generate something called a dashboard, which will analyze the whole portfolio for you, which is very convenient.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. W we've done it both ways. The, you know, just keying in one property at a time or doing a group of them and the spreadsheet and the processes is the same speed and the same, uh, quality of service. So thanks for all the hard work you've done building your company up. Uh, everyone, obviously that I know of pretty much uses ProTitle, uh, for their title searches and in the note space specifically that I'm in.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, we have many clients would like to, to grow to, uh, to more and more clients and keep them happy. So,

Speaker 2:

Elizabeth, uh, Alex has also written a book and it's called the Bulletproof title of due diligence. And you can find this I and correct me if I'm wrong. Alice, I think this is on Amazon. You can find on

Speaker 4:

Amazon. Yeah. That's that's the bulk, uh, yeah, it's Amazon. Oh. Um, the purpose of that book was really to educate beginner investor on what things can hurt. You. Don't get scared of the book, uh, readers, understand all the liens and issues that, um, might make you lose money. So, uh, we wanted to make sure that everybody who is playing in the real estate investment business or know the investment business reads the book. So you're more educated about, uh, reading without a reports.

Speaker 2:

You know, I've, I've, uh, gotten your reports before, but I've, I've missed a few things that I should've paid attention to before early in my, my note investing days. And, uh, I paid for it. So it's very important that you understand, uh, the report that is given to you and actually read through it and make sure you, you ask questions that could be potentially a problem because when you buy an asset like that, especially a note, it's very important to read through that, that title report and see what

Speaker 4:

You got. Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So, uh, you mentioned earlier about you have a, that 10 us patents,

Speaker 4:

I think it's nine, nine or 10. Yeah. Most of them are related to a Calico.

Speaker 2:

Oh, okay. So this was your, before you started ProTitle

Speaker 4:

Exactly. Okay.

Speaker 2:

That's pretty cool. We'll have to have a conversation with that offline about what that's like patents. I was always interested in how that works. So, Elizabeth, did you have any final thoughts for today?

Speaker 3:

Good. I just want to say Alex, thank you so much for obviously you're a very successful business owner in scaling like that and especially your insight for what's coming, because that will help a lot of our listeners plan accordingly to make their real estate goals.

Speaker 4:

Yeah. And thank you guys for inviting me. I had a lot of fun and, uh, for anybody who wants to reach out to me, go ahead and email me. Um, uh, I think once you go to the website, you will find an email link there and, uh, we'll be happy to answer any of your questions

Speaker 2:

And that's pro title usa.com. All right, Alex, do you have any final thoughts about due diligence or title that you want to share with our, with our listener here before we close out today?

Speaker 4:

Yeah, I think, well, uh, I think you must have the title search when you invest, right. Don't make a mistake of buying something without running with title search. This is why I made this company. This is why I wanted to make sure that everybody's protected. Um, I've seen many people make mistakes when I was buying, uh, the, the real estate without the battle search I paid for it, but it was not, it was not cheap. It was$20,000 losses. I don't do that again. So for the title search, which is on average, I dunno,$85 a plus or minus. It might be cheaper if you're in Florida or Georgia or expensive you, if you're in Mississippi and other rural, uh, spots of us. Um, but it's, it's worth it to get it. That's, that's kind of keep that thought in mind. Um, if you don't buy the property because of the title search it's we just saved you a lot of money.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely. Alex again, thank you. Thank you so much for being on our show and educating our listeners today. We greatly appreciate that. And I'm Justin Bogart with bright path notes, and this is episode number 13, and

Speaker 3:

I'm Elizabeth with Elizabeth Medora. I guys we'll see you next time. Thank you

Speaker 1:

Too. We'll show was produced by Justin Bogart and super eat, sponsored by Bryghtpath notes and Elizabeth, my Hora. Thanks for listening and watching for our show.

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